During my 30 years at City Hall I had seen and read and heard so many different stories about the origins of the "Six Old Grouches" so proudly displayed on City welcome signs going back for so many years that I decided to contact as many people as I could to get their story. Below is a compilation of those recollections. I'm not sure if we will ever really know but I think one thing stands out and that is back in the day our City leaders numbered six and not the current five we have today.
1949 Council authorized payment of a bill from R. Senne for lumber for new sign at south end of City
Lani Deauville, who lived in Roseland and owned Greens Plus, called me and said she lived in Daytona Beach starting in 1941 and at about age 11 in the early 1950's she and her mother traveled US 1 to Key West twice a year. She said her mother was a numbers person and she said when they went through Sebastian they noticed the sign that said
"Welcome to Sebastian - Home of (100+ she couldn't quite remember the number) and six old Grouches". She said they loved the sign and the following year they stopped and her mother asked someone to whom it referred and was told it was the Mayor and Council. She said the year was probably 1952 or 1953.
My husband (Fred Maio) told me today (March 13, 2009) that two women were photographing Louisiana Avenue near his auto body shop before Louisiana Avenue was repaved in 2005, and they came over to talk to him and said they had grown up in Sebastian and were now living in Pennsylvania and Maine. They said that many years ago there was a sign that said "Welcome to Sebastian - Home of 113 Friendly People" and someone had painted "and an old grouch" on the sign. They told him the grouch was someone who attended Council meetings and then later on they changed the sign from "an old grouch" to "six ole grouches" and it was now the Council they were referring to. The population in the 1950s was around 100+ (Sally Maio, City Clerk)
1954 Council passed a motion to draw up a resolution accepting Pelican Island signs to be placed somewhere in City, providing upkeep is minor, to include painting every second or third year, and that if signs are destroyed by wind, flood, fire or other Act of God, City will not replace same. Mr. Sembler said one sign could be placed on his property and J.T. Thompson had offered to place other sign on his property with the actual spot to be designated by him. Councilmen Chesser and Ellingsen were appointed as a committee to find a location for Conservation Department Pelican signs.
1958 Council passed motion to purchase two 100 sq. ft. signs in luminous letters for each end of City limits; also, signs and posts for the signs. Motion seconded to have Pelican Island signs moved from the old US Highway 1 to new US Highway 1.
1960 Mr. Brehmer reported receiving permission from Julius Dewaele to place a sign advertising Pelican Island. Mr. Baxter reported that the Pelican Island sign had been moved to south city limits on US Highway 1.
1962 Council authorized the Clerk to receive bids for welcome signs at north and south City limits on US Highway 1
1963 Council accepted bid of Klinkner Sign, Inc. to place two signs at north and south City limits for $1,026.
Russ Lemmon who publishes Lemmon Drops told me today that he had received a call from Don Owen who said he was on Council in 1962 and recalled that then City Clerk Colonel Jordan told Council that General Development Corporation, with which the City was negotiating, thought the Council were a bunch of old grouches and that is when the sign with the six old grouches was done. I checked and Mr. Owen was appointed to the Zoning Board in 1962 and then was elected to Council December 1964 and served through December 1966.
Colonel Jordan was City Clerk from 1962-1973 when Florence Phelan was named City Clerk.
1970 Sebastian population 825 (University of FL census)
1972 Council passed a motion to advertise for bids to replace one "Pelican Island" sign and refurbish another; Pelicans to be "white type" - Accepted bid of $922.90 by Elliot Sign Co. for Pelican Island signs - Instructed Clerk to purchase signs to be placed along US Highway 1 - Instructed Clerk to get estimate on replacing "Welcome" sign at south City limits Sebastian Sun Article 1997
" .... It (community center) was built in 1974 to provide the people of Sebastian and outlying areas a place to congregate, hold meetings and to host receptions. In 1974, Sebastian, a sleepy fishing village then, had a population of 800 people and very few old grouches."
Russ Lemmon has a photo from the Sebastian River Historical Society showing the sign with "952 Friendly People and Six Ole Grouches".
There is a photograph in the Council Chambers of a sign with "1400 Friendly People and Six Ole Grouches".
1978 Mayor reported quote of $540 each to repair and repaint signs at either end of City; Mr. Vocelle said that since amount was over $1,000, it would have to be put out for bid; Council passed motion to bid on two signs and also a sign for SR 512 - Mayor reported quote of $540 each to repair and repaint signs at either end of City
1980 Superintendent Wehr reported Street Dept. repaired two signs at each end of town that were damaged by Hurricane David
1980 Mr. Wehr suggested changing the sign showing City population as 1,600 to more realistic figure; Mayor suggested 4,000 but felt City should conduct a census
1980 Sebastian population 2,831 (UFL census)
1982 As of April 1, 1982, the population here had swelled to 4,225 (from Sebastian Sun 1983 article)
1984 I recall when my husband and I moved to Sebastian in 1984 the sign said "4000 (plus - can't recall exact number) Friendly People and Six Ole Grouches".
1984 Sebastian Sun Article article by Jack Fay
'The sign just outside of town that says Welcome to Sebastian--4,600 friendly people and six ole grouches," seems to have caught the attention of one of the area's daily papers. The paper took a picture, showing Councilman Jim Gallagher, Dorothy McKinley and Richard Szeluga, in a supposedly grouchy mood, although you could tell they were having a hard time "whomping" up a grouchy mood. Well, everybody knows the sign is all wrong. Even Charlie the Squirrel knows there are a lot more than six old grouches in Sebastian. Some days the sign should be painted to say "Six friendly people and 4,600 ole grouches". And, it's outdated. The population has increased to between six and seven thousand so that makes even more grouches, on a bad day. If you don't believe me, ask my telephone, which has borne the brunt of more than one old grouch 's bean bag attack, when I spelled his name wrong. How did I know he spelled his name Smythe instead of Smith?"
January 1984 Florida Today Article by Linda Hall - Sign's Origin Still a Mystery-Old grouches' names object of speculation
"Despite living in Sebastian all his life, Mayor Pat Flood did not know. Even though he used to be on the city council, Charles Zimmer could not say when it happened. And although he was responsible for the formation of the city, Jim Vocelle wasn't sure either. Maybe the pelican that graces the city of Sebastian sign knows when and why the population is touted as "4,600 friendly people & 6 ole grouches!" are in the city of Sebastian.
"We used to have a weak mayor type of council," Flood explained. "That is where the 'six ole grouches' come from." When the sign was renewed in 1971, the six was never changed, Flood said. "It should have been changed to five ole grouches. " Wrong", said Councilman Richard Szeluga. "At that time I believe it was referring to the council and clerk." No. that cannot be correct, Councilman Robert Fitzmaurice said. "She (City Clerk Debbie Krages) is not old." Then maybe resident Anne Dewhurst is right. "I understood it (the sixth grouch) was the chief of police."
That's not it either, longtime resident Sallydale Wimbrow said. "I used to go to the meetings but he (former Police Chief Jim Cummins) was never a grouch."
Former City Clerk Florence Phelan couldn't pinpoint the grouches but "the only thing I know about that is it is Col. A. T. Jordan's idea.
"It started with 800 people and six ole grouches" about 20 years ago, she said.
Longtime resident Rodney Kroegel has a different theory. "I don't know if they were imaginary or if there really were that many - probably some of the citizens around here." That could be, Vocelle said, considering the origin of Sebastian. See, Sebastian used to be the focal point of smuggling contraband liquor from Bimini in the 1920s. Seems an Indian River County sheriff and a Melbourne man went to a federal penitentiary for the smuggling. Well, the old families in the area wanted "to organize a town and have some degree of control over what was happening," Vocelle said.
In 1924, people who lived within an area who wished to be incorporated could call a meeting of registered voters and if two-thirds came they could become a city, he said. No vote was necessary. When Vocelle published the notice, the group that was opposing it told people to stay away from the meeting.
But their curiosity got the better of them, Vocelle said. They showed up at the meeting and were included in the roll call of registered voters. "When they woke up they found they were incorporated."
And later there was this funny sign down the street talking about 800 residents and six ole grouches.
1990 Sebastian population 10,248 (UFL census)
2000 census - population 16,181
2000 City Council agenda item: Curt Oxford, Woodcarver, Inc. City Welcome Signs Update and Status Report 2/23/2000 agenda - Resolution No. R-00-43 Adoption of New City Seal and Logo and Establish Value of Donation adopted - Approve Contract with Curt Oxford Woodcarver, Inc. for Manufacture of New Signs and Plaques for City of Sebastian in the Amount of $19,200 approved - following some discussion on staff it was decided to leave the six old grouches message and in 2001 new City welcome signs were erected on US 1 at both city limits with a new Pelican logo and a changed message to read "Friendly People and Six Old Grouches"
Now that Sebastian's population in 2023 (as of this writing) has swelled to 26,907 it is still clear there are still only six old grouches. Let's hope it stays that way! Wink Wink!!
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